Chinwag 02 Transcript
Chris Siracuse 00:05
We don't have to clap video. For anyone that's listening where we promised video and previous episodes.
Martin O'Toole 00:13
We lied.
Chris Siracuse 00:14
We lied.
Martin O'Toole 00:16
Well, we didn't lie. Do you want to explain that briefly?
Chris Siracuse 00:18
Your video is just super hard to do. Even though I used to be a professional cinematographer and filmmaker videos is proven to be too difficult for me.
Martin O'Toole 00:29
Not to say we won't have video What, what's basically happened? I'm not gonna boy, we'll get videos.
Chris Siracuse 00:35
We'll get video at some point.
Martin O'Toole 00:36
We'll have video. So it's the second chinwag
Chris Siracuse 00:41
It is the second chinwag.
Martin O'Toole 00:43
Welcome to the second chinwag.
Chris Siracuse 00:45
Welcome.
Martin O'Toole 00:46
Welcome to you, Christopher. And to our audience who really enjoyed the first chinwag. I've had some great feedback. I don't know about you. We've had some great feedback.
Chris Siracuse 00:57
Yeah. Good, good. Good.
Martin O'Toole 00:59
So I want to talk about dogs.
Chris Siracuse 01:02
You want to talk about dogs, okay. I'm down to talk about dogs
Martin O'Toole 01:05
You like dogs.
Chris Siracuse 01:06
I love dogs.
Martin O'Toole 01:07
Some people love dogs. Some people hate them.
Chris Siracuse 01:12
I don't know how you could hate dogs, but Okay, yeah, I follow ya.
Martin O'Toole 01:15
Yeah. Yeah, well, was interesting, because, actually, a lot of our Muslim brothers and sisters don't like dogs. And this, this ca— sort of came up last week with a dog issue. And I so I did a bit of research about it. It turns out the Islamic scholar Sahih Bukhari wrote the following words. Once Gabriel promised the Prophet that he would visit him, but Gabriel did not come. And later on he said, We angels do not enter a house, which contains a picture of a dog.
Chris Siracuse 01:51
Wow. Right. So this is a Muslim Prophet saying that the angels don't come into a house that has a picture of a dog
Martin O'Toole 01:58
Exacto, and apparently, according to some scholars, this is why a lot of Muslims don't like dogs, but also Muhammad really didn't like dogs. So the Prophet Muhammad ordered the killing of dogs. So
Chris Siracuse 02:15
So he was a cat person. Okay,
Martin O'Toole 02:21
yeah,
Chris Siracuse 02:22
that's cool.
Martin O'Toole 02:22
I don't know. Or maybe he had a reptile collection. Hmm. All right.
Chris Siracuse 02:27
So all this setting up for this conversation that you want to have about dogs?
Martin O'Toole 02:31
Yeah.
Chris Siracuse 02:31
And one dog in particular.
Martin O'Toole 02:33
And no disrespect to our Muslim brothers and sisters either. Yeah, well, on the one hand, the prophet Mohammed didn't like dogs, but but then ancient Iranians loved dogs. On the flip side of that, just FYI. So they believed they, they were to be revered and respected. And I think it was, I think they had such a deep love for dogs that it would be considered a damnable or evil act to hurt a dog in any way.
Chris Siracuse 03:07
This is the Persians
Martin O'Toole 03:09
No, I don't think they would call the Persians but I see where you're going with that no, they I can't read what they were called began with a Zed and he was said so I'm not sure if that perhaps their love I think they had a bit of a fallout with the the Sunni Muslims and so it could be that because they loved dogs so much, Sunni Muslims decided it would be vicariously having a prod at their enemies by hurting dogs.
Chris Siracuse 03:39
I see
Martin O'Toole 03:39
anyway, I don't really want to talk about that for too long. It was really more about dogs. So I did I tell you about the time I was in an Eastern European country with a billionaire Olligarch. Sitting in the grounds of some while they were literally palatial grounds, and he told me about his dog and a black panther.
Chris Siracuse 04:08
No, you've never told me the story. K, I'm gonna tell you a quick story tell me stories is not the story this is not the story about dogs but just made me think about you know people's love for dogs so I'm sitting I can't really I can't tell you who this person was. But I'm sitting is really bizarre weekend sort of meeting really went went to this Eastern European capital to meet this billionaire golly Ark sitting in his palatial grounds. And we're having a drink and a chat about business and he and his partner walked by and she was a very attractive woman think she might have been a supermodel and and she had a little Yorkshire Terrier. You know, Yorkshire Terriers. idea. Yeah, yeah. So she had a Yorkshire Terrier and, and he said something like, she loved that dog. And I said, You know, I love dogs. I like dogs. I'm not gonna go there but if you know you know
Martin O'Toole 05:04
yeah, exactly so and I said well it's a very cute dog he's third third one. I said sorry his third one. The third one What do you mean? Is clone
Chris Siracuse 05:24
okay?
Martin O'Toole 05:27
What do you mean it's a clone? She once have terrier. She loved the idea. Teddy a die. I have it clone I'm not bullshitting you
Chris Siracuse 05:41
I don't believe that you are
Martin O'Toole 05:42
This legit happened
Chris Siracuse 05:44
Okay,
Martin O'Toole 05:45
so anyway the long the long story short it was the third version so and I said so what happened to the two he said every time we just said it died. Oh, okay. I'm really sorry Yeah, is bad. And
Chris Siracuse 06:02
so we're sorry I just want to get the few things straight here was so it was a clone of a clone. So the first one we have the original terrier and then the second one was a clone obviously the original I would imagine but if that one died then it would have been a clone of a clone.
Martin O'Toole 06:18
No
Chris Siracuse 06:18
Unless he clone two at the same time
Martin O'Toole 06:20
I would imagine the clones were clones of the original dog. So really interesting questioning I didn't I didn't think to ask because if the first clone failed, you'd probably think
Chris Siracuse 06:31
I want a backup clone?
Martin O'Toole 06:32
Yeah, but you wouldn't be wanting to use the same DNA would you or at least you'd want to be tinkering with that DNA i don't know i'm not really I didn't know anything about clones?
Chris Siracuse 06:41
No, but I know stuff about degradation. And and dig like I know something about marijuana farming and clones well
Martin O'Toole 06:49
what?!
Chris Siracuse 06:50
when you clone a clone of a marijuana plant you have to be careful because you start to essentially degrade the genetics
Martin O'Toole 06:57
ah yeah
Chris Siracuse 06:58
so anyway
Martin O'Toole 06:58
yeah, well that makes sense so so my suspicion is I don't know and it doesn't really matter for the for the point of the story but right right I would imagine there was an original dog it died they had the dog cloned that died they had that dog cloned I think that one died and then there's a third one I'm pretty sure three dogs
Chris Siracuse 07:17
so it was a clone of clone of a clone Okay, wow okay, so I'm sorry I'm gonna go ahead I just wanted to clarify that and that's that's interesting this one
Martin O'Toole 07:25
however it was alive and so everybody was happy and
Chris Siracuse 07:29
for the time being
Martin O'Toole 07:30
and he said before I get her black panther
Chris Siracuse 07:36
well That's nice of you.
Martin O'Toole 07:37
And I said well sorry um, yeah, obviously I'm trying to have a business meeting at some at the time I was this was a long time ago I was drinking wine
Chris Siracuse 07:45
You do business with some interesting characters
Martin O'Toole 07:47
it was a it was a very curious meeting wonder really really
Chris Siracuse 07:52
charming guys So anyway, so sorry I got pulled you off there
Martin O'Toole 07:55
No, no you're fine so so he tells me that originally got her a black panther and I said where's the Black Panther? It died
Chris Siracuse 08:05
of course it did.
Martin O'Toole 08:06
Oh, god I'm so sorry to hear that you've had bad luck with your pets. We have it cloned. I have my spat my wine at this point. Because it turns out they cloned the Black Panther too
Chris Siracuse 08:23
okay i mean again, I want I want to believe this I do know that there was I don't know much about cloning. But obviously this guy had money.
Martin O'Toole 08:35
He was he was a billionaire. And and I think this I think this sort of sings to the fact that we lowly serfs, just have no idea what you can actually
Chris Siracuse 08:47
wow
Martin O'Toole 08:47
buy when you're that well you
Chris Siracuse 08:48
can just clone your favourite pet
Martin O'Toole 08:51
or a Black Panther.
Chris Siracuse 08:54
I mean, first of all, I can't even address the fact that he has in the day had the Black Panther because it's just it's just so crazy about the cloning of the Black Panther crazy that's not even addressing the the original fact that you have a black panther or had
Martin O'Toole 09:11
but then that makes makes me think what what else did you clone your Gran?
Chris Siracuse 09:20
Yeah, he just kind of you were clone we had a clone. It's very hard to clone to just cloning everything
Martin O'Toole 09:25
we clone.
Chris Siracuse 09:26
So the great story hilarious. Not the story, not the story but kind of sets the stage for the story.
Martin O'Toole 09:34
Kind of does have a bit of a tangent.
Chris Siracuse 09:39
Hey, that's fine.
Martin O'Toole 09:40
Oh, okay. No, no
Chris Siracuse 09:41
It's what chinwags are for.
Martin O'Toole 09:42
the reason why that. I told that story was because these people obviously loved dogs,
Chris Siracuse 09:48
and Panthers
Martin O'Toole 09:50
and Panthers and gosh knows what else. I don't know what else they cloned. But so I thought I'd just talk briefly about My dog my old dog Macy she was a beagle. And, and I guess this this plays into the interview we have with Rebecca Jaxx on Thursday, which is Episode Three, right? Of proper guest interviews. Rebecca is a suicide survivor and loss and grief counsellor.
Chris Siracuse 10:26
So just to clarify, we say suicide survivor, her younger brother. Yeah, Committed suicide
Martin O'Toole 10:32
She survived the suicide of her brother. Yes. Yeah, I guess that's an interesting play on words. So, yeah, in in preparation for that, it made me think about the time I almost committed suicide. And I figured we would have a quick chat about it, probably worth me putting a little caution. Therefore, in advance of this chat, we are going to talk about suicide, grief and loss in this discussion and in the next discussion, we will do it with hopefully, the right level of brevity and, and respect but as you know, hopefully by now the point of the How To Die Happy podcast is not to just drop tales of woe for us all to swim around in a sea of turgid suffering, it's more really about sharing these stories out loud but then also discussing utilities and practical ways that we can get out of these things you know, get out of this these feelings so so you I asked you, I suppose the audience to just be forgiving of any forthright language that we might use or Or, we're laughing because obviously we don't think it's funny that people kill themselves. Now on to that, so
Chris Siracuse 11:56
Martin tell me about the night that a beagle saved your life Well, actually I've got some news last night broken heart—Yeah, so that was who did that song?
Martin O'Toole 12:16
don't know should credit them
Chris Siracuse 12:18
well, it is a song titled last night a DJ saved my life to which Martin has altered to to now say last night a beagle saved my life
Martin O'Toole 12:29
so yeah, back back in the day twin 2015 ish. I think it was I was having a pretty interesting time of it all co-created definitely drowning in in my own self-suffering. Not to be not to do Martin version 1.0 any injustice here he had a bit of an interesting time of it up until then. Anyway, I was feeling pretty low super low. The the epitome of depressed well, arguably as depressed as you can get, because I had a loaded shotgun in my mouth and a bottle of gin inside me was literally seconds off, blowing my own brains out and the door just sort of creaked open and Macy quite a young pup at the time just sort of wanders in just plunks down and just gave me this look like what you're doing. Or can I have my dinner?
Chris Siracuse 13:44
before you do this, I'm going to need to eat. I mean, regardless, though, she entered at the right time
Martin O'Toole 13:54
she did my dog translation skills were, you know, they were new. They were newfound. So one of the two messages was being conveyed with eyebrows, you know, like dogs do that with their eyebrows.
Chris Siracuse 14:05
Yeah. Well, I'm glad you brought in the humour there because you were about to make me cry.
Martin O'Toole 14:08
Ah, well, we can. We can work on that.
Chris Siracuse 14:11
Yeah. Little Macy and, okay.
Martin O'Toole 14:15
Little Macy. She came in, she saved my life. So
Chris Siracuse 14:20
Wow.
Martin O'Toole 14:20
And I did I just sort of, I think I joyously cried, you know, shook my head, pulled the gun away, you know, emptied, it just sort of sat in a moment of kind of, wow, I actually nearly just blew my brains out. And I think we just had a cuddle. So that was around 2015. Fast forward through a few more years of co-created drama and self-suffering. And in early 2019, as you know, Macy and I packed up left London, sold or gave away everything I owned. spent a significant amount of money I didn't really have on exporting Macy to Bali she was on the same flight as me She flew Emirates not business class. Beagle class
Chris Siracuse 15:14
I mean I think after that she deserved business class
Martin O'Toole 15:18
she did for sure
Chris Siracuse 15:20
The dog saved your life Martin.
Martin O'Toole 15:22
Yeah. And we had this amazing time together obviously we lived in London for four years together and and had some crazy crazy times through that and that dog and I mean that dog was with me through some of the darkest times of my life. And just back to other people's beliefs about dogs, there are many people that believe that dogs are guardian angels that they are the body of the dog has been utilised by a higher dimensional entity. A spirit guide if you like.
Chris Siracuse 15:56
I believe that I don't know I don't want to derail the story here, but I'm just going to interject really quickly.
Martin O'Toole 16:02
It's a chinwag.
Chris Siracuse 16:02
It is a chinwag. So I don't think I ever told you about the time that my house burned down. Our golden retriever named Buddy saved our lives.
Martin O'Toole 16:13
Whoa! No.
Chris Siracuse 16:15
Yeah, the house caught fire in the middle of the night. so windy night. I was in high school. Yeah. 15 or 16. The house caught fire in the middle of the night. And buddy ran around the house barking again. It's one of those things like probably self preservation, you know, he had to get out.
Martin O'Toole 16:30
No,
Chris Siracuse 16:30
can't open the door.
Martin O'Toole 16:32
No, I refuse to believe it. Have you Do you remember that? You remember that? TV show the littlest hobo no Lassie remember Lassie?
Chris Siracuse 16:39
Of course Yeah,
Martin O'Toole 16:40
The Littlest Hobo, Lassie, the same vibe. rescuing somebody every week. Yeah, let's do that. Lastly, be like RUFFRUFFRUFF, your house is on fire.
Chris Siracuse 16:50
But he was no Lassie. It was a wonderful dog. But yeah, he Yeah, it could be a little It was definitely a little Lassie thing. The local news station did a story on him that night. And I was interviewed by the news and I was like typical little punk. 16 year old I'm sitting there like chewing gum on the news interviewer just like Yeah, he saved our lives pretty cool. Yeah. Good boy. He's,
Martin O'Toole 17:17
he's okay.
Chris Siracuse 17:17
He's cool.
Martin O'Toole 17:18
Did you get him a treat?
Chris Siracuse 17:19
Yeah, many many treats he up we upgraded houses too. But anyway, to your point, I believe I think I'm one of these people that believes that dogs and cats to a certain extent are a little guardian angels because I've had that experience and I'd look into some of their eyes and just like whoa, there's just so much going on there.
Martin O'Toole 17:37
Yeah, some of them. Not all of them know like the two dogs I have now
Chris Siracuse 17:43
We're seen sitting here looking at ATI and Mudah and they're both just chewing on this plank of wood
Martin O'Toole 17:49
biting each other's ankles. Yeah,
Chris Siracuse 17:51
not a whole lot going on there. They're adorable I love them to death but
Martin O'Toole 17:59
perhaps the angels can enter the dog's body anytime
Chris Siracuse 18:03
yeah maybe it's like a some maturity thing is watching they're just not in this corner of wood that does not there's nothing about that that looks good
Martin O'Toole 18:13
she's into it
Chris Siracuse 18:14
she's very into it but yeah, I'm hoping for I think our team Buddha have the capacity for having that guardian angel entity and because they're very loving quite possibly yeah I think so.
Martin O'Toole 18:27
Took me it took me a while to get to get ready to to welcome dogs back into my life because
Chris Siracuse 18:34
after Macy?
Martin O'Toole 18:35
yeah. because as some people might know, we've been in Bali this fantastic journey spiritually and physically we've been on this fantastic journey
Chris Siracuse 18:47
you and Macy, so yeah pick up so you came over in 2018-19 we she did not fly business class.
Martin O'Toole 18:53
No she was in you know what the hold but Emirates have a warm like dog friendly hold. Which is which was cool. And well I don't know wasn't cool because he was warm. And also I wasn't in the dog was in it but I guess
Chris Siracuse 19:08
but she was okay. She made it
Martin O'Toole 19:09
she was fine. So we flew into Jakarta and and then I brought her over to Bali. Road trip like
Chris Siracuse 19:18
oh wow you drove over
Martin O'Toole 19:19
No I didn't two brothers picked us up from Berlin they drove they took time that took turns driving. every four hours one was driving one was sleeping. It was like a 36 hour non stop trip.
Chris Siracuse 19:32
Whoa
Martin O'Toole 19:32
just me the dog in the back. coffee's bad street food, bad music blah blah blah.
Chris Siracuse 19:39
Sounds like a proper Indonesian road trip.
Martin O'Toole 19:41
Yeah, it was it was it was an adventure and I the dog and the dog wasn't really all that impressed because obviously she'd been left in in some quarantine situation for a few days. It took a while for her to berfriend me again. But when we finally got dropped off the first thing I did, because we were live They're the same as I just took her straight to the beach and let her off the lead and she was now what a lot of people don't know about Macy is that she loved to swim. So we our office was in London, near the Thames, the dirty Thames River. And every day I take her for a walk and she would just run and jump into the Thames and swim against the current people like hundreds of people just stand by this on the riverbank just look at this crazy beagle as she dove into the Thames you know, swimming that sucker. So when I said, this is it bud. We live on the we live next to the Indian Ocean now it's in the back garden, she went crazy. And for three months that dog had the best time. Like she was just constantly jumping in, jumping in chasing sticks, asking people to give her to throw sticks in the in the sea. If you were unfortunate enough to throw a stick for this strange yapping Beagle one time, you could not get rid of the Beagle, she would just follow you all the way at the beach, spit the stick and say throw it
Chris Siracuse 21:03
what Beach was this, where you live in the
Martin O'Toole 21:05
Sanur beach, and then Ketewel up on the east coast. And it was where and so I sort of this was when I was doing a lot of the big work, you know, the going inward I was I wasn't working. I wasn't working. I was doing the wonderful work and, and I sort of but I was still going through a lot of stuff. And I decided I like to go out on a couple of dates. As I guess I was feeling quite lonely and went out on a couple of dates with this lady who, frankly, wasn't an appropriate partner certainly wasn't partner material. And, and I've, to this day still have a little pang of regret. And I was out with this girl when Macy went missing. One One day, one night, I got home, she just she wasn't there. And the garden was wide open to the beach. And she would wander, she would wander with the other dogs, but she would always come home when I go home. And so a few days went by obviously I'm searching around I'm printing things and people are posting stickers everywhere and posters. And then I put this $1,000 reward up for Macy's return and it got a lot of coverage, like a lot of coverage to the point where I went into the Bali sun, not the Bali sun. Bali post. Can't remember major newspaper, and also Bali TVs office was in there. And I was talking to this employee about putting an ad in the paper and this Balinese chap who overheard me talking now I was quite distraught, obviously. And he says I'm sorry to interrupt, but I own the newspaper and I also own the TV station. Would you like to go on the news tonight and talk about your missing dog? I'm like what? And I already had like people like musician Indonesia Indonesian musicians and healers and people of influence all around the island were already sharing these posts about this missing Beagle a whole like everybody was was looking for Macy,
Chris Siracuse 23:10
they wanted that $1,000
Martin O'Toole 23:12
Well, there is that but also there was a bit of a—it felt to me like there was a lot of love coming from a lot of corners of the earth at that point a lot people say way out especially people back in the UK who knew my history with this hound
Chris Siracuse 23:23
Yeah, people love money
Martin O'Toole 23:26
ye of little faith. And anyway, I was on the news. It was it was on the news four or five times and it was an it was in the paper. It was all over the place. People all over the island knew about this missing beagle. Nevertheless, Mason never came back.
Chris Siracuse 23:42
You never told me this part of the story.
Martin O'Toole 23:45
Yeah, she never came back. And after a few weeks, friend of mine said, I don't know how open you are to this. But I I'd like to give you the details of a pet psychic.
Chris Siracuse 24:01
Okay. Okay, all right. Yeah. I knew there was something else. Okay. Continue my friend.
Martin O'Toole 24:21
So now, so I reached out to this lady. Wonderful, wonderful soul called Angela. And she's she's in South Africa.
Chris Siracuse 24:31
Okay. So you reached out her ouch out to her for the sake of
Martin O'Toole 24:37
finding Macy. But obviously didn't know where Macy was right. So
Chris Siracuse 24:42
obviously, that's why naturally the next step is to reach out to a dog psychic in South Africa,
Martin O'Toole 24:47
right?
Chris Siracuse 24:48
Yeah. And of course,
Martin O'Toole 24:49
okay, so—so I sent Angela a few photos of Macy and Macy's details, the date of birth and yada yada. Didn't tell it anything else about our story. Okay. This is important
Chris Siracuse 25:01
it is important but also as previously discussed the story was all over the Indonesian news so
Martin O'Toole 25:06
well a modicum of the story yeah certainly not our our whole our whole you know vibe and how she how she was my essentially my guardian angel
Chris Siracuse 25:16
Your guardian angel okay I see
Martin O'Toole 25:18
okay so I reached out to her and I'm going to show you the message I got back
Chris Siracuse 25:24
we're gonna do this again?
Martin O'Toole 25:25
yeah not not to duplicate a format
Chris Siracuse 25:29
no no I like it I actually enjoy it I think there is something to play in these these conversations out. You spelt My name wrong but that's okay
Martin O'Toole 25:36
It's here. So, first thing would you mind reading the first message that I got?
Chris Siracuse 25:43
Okay, so again to be clear here so what I'm reading is a message from Angela the South African pet psychic after Martin has reached out to her inquiring about Macy,
Martin O'Toole 25:56
can you tell me where my Beagle is? Yeah,
Chris Siracuse 25:58
so that's what you said okay. So this is an email from her
Martin O'Toole 26:02
It's actually another WhatsApp All the magic happens via WhatsApp
Chris Siracuse 26:12
What a beautiful technology that is. Dear Martin. I've picked up the Macy has crossed over the rainbow bridge I'm sorry to tell you that you're Anam Cora is not here anymore.
Martin O'Toole 26:23
Anam cara
Chris Siracuse 26:24
Anam cara?
Martin O'Toole 26:26
essentially means soul friend. Now this is an interesting point.
Chris Siracuse 26:30
You want me to finish this?
Martin O'Toole 26:31
Well yeah, we should talk about the nm car and briefly, it's actually Irish spiritual mythology. So the spirit friend, soul friend, if you like Anam Cara is Irish, and I thought that was quite interesting. That is interesting because she's in South Africa. I'm English in barley, but of course I have Irish descent.
Chris Siracuse 26:52
And one of the beagles Irish Beagle doesn't doesn't seem like Scottish or Irish
Martin O'Toole 26:57
What as in the breed?
Chris Siracuse 26:58
Yeah,
Martin O'Toole 26:58
that's also a good question. I don't
Chris Siracuse 27:00
I feel like it is I don't know I'm not gonna say I'm not a dog expert. Okay, so that's good to know. So Anam Cara is your soul friend.
Martin O'Toole 27:06
And of course so back to me receiving this heartbreaking news.
Chris Siracuse 27:10
Okay, so let me start again, dear Martin, I've picked up the Macy's crossed over the rainbow bridge. I'm sorry to tell you that your Anam Cara is not here anymore. Not in the physical sense. I am deeply sorry for your loss in this friend and soulmate, but she does wish to talk to you. Okay, I'm sorry. Okay, um,
Martin O'Toole 27:31
why are you laughing Chris?
Chris Siracuse 27:36
Is there more? I see your response to this. Well, first Can I ask um, how did that feel that was pre Did you believe right away?
Martin O'Toole 27:44
Um, I did actually because because I'd had some feedback as to what she'd done with somebody else already.
Chris Siracuse 27:51
What Oh, you mean Angela the pet—
Martin O'Toole 27:53
As in a success story.
Chris Siracuse 27:54
I see, Okay, so how much how long after Macy disappeared Are you getting this message?
Martin O'Toole 27:59
Well I'd reached out a few weeks after she'd gone missing because I mean miles running around the island doing the whole search thing so so I responded and said something like, Man... Bummer... pretty good to to hear that yes, I would like to hear from Macy Would you be able to send me —
Chris Siracuse 28:24
I know I know I'm
Martin O'Toole 28:31
Heartless American friend
Chris Siracuse 28:32
I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I say you wish to speak to Macy
Martin O'Toole 28:39
I wish to speak to Macy
Chris Siracuse 28:40
What do you say you can you you asked her
Martin O'Toole 28:42
please reach out so she said okay, I'm going to reach out it might take me a couple of days when it when I'm in the right space bla bla bla. I'll count I'll come back to you. Okay, so maybe a couple of days later, I get this message I'd like you to read this message.
Chris Siracuse 28:57
Okay.
Martin O'Toole 29:04
I don't believe you giving this the
Chris Siracuse 29:10
okay. So again, this is the message via this is the header here is from Macy. So this is from Macy, the Beagle who was lost on the island of Bali. Now, Macy is being channelled through Angela, the South African pet psychic that Martin has reached out to in his in his grief and his desperation. So the message reads from Macy, I'm grateful to speak to let Martin know why what might let Martin know what my story is that I miss him, and I'm grateful for the friendship and love He gave me. We have travelled a long journey together. We have an opportunity to shine our souls in unison once again, to extend ourselves into a new future. On the day I left him I woke up tired, deep tiredness in my heart. The tiredness became a stress and the heat of the day seemed to make it worse. So I walked to find deep shade. I needed the cold earth against my body. She says that you are not to feel guilt. You're not to feel despair. You're an incredible human who cared for her and put her needs as equal to your own. Your service and love are so gratefully received. She said that you needed the release of loyalties to an old life that you needed a clean break, a reset of sorts, she merely facilitated the shift and took the ends to be tied off on the other side. She has created an opportunity for nothing to pull you backwards out of alignment with this new life you are creating. Also know that while you might experience her body as gone, her spirit is an intrinsic part of your life purpose. To honour yourself completely with compassion and forgiveness opens new avenues for your souls to walk on the earth together again. She says that you can let go of sadness. She can only come back when you look for love inside. Damn dude!!! Well now it's not so funny
Martin O'Toole 31:13
No, you're crying! And you got, you've got tearful is
Chris Siracuse 31:17
that's pretty touching.
Martin O'Toole 31:19
It's amazing, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah, I was.
Chris Siracuse 31:22
Wow,
Martin O'Toole 31:23
on my way back from a road trip. I'd been writing up in the north. And I stopped to read the message and then I had to keep riding my gosh, by the time I got in on the bike. I was just sobbing. sobbing sobbing sobbing
Chris Siracuse 31:38
Wow.
Martin O'Toole 31:40
It really really resonated with me, I have to say and this woman knew nothing about my story or our journey and it being a physical or a metaphysical journey or an emotional journey whatever she knew nothing about it. I should say that Ati and Mudah are yapping in the background so apologies for the noise so Yeah,
Chris Siracuse 32:04
wow,
Martin O'Toole 32:05
wow. Wow, right?
Chris Siracuse 32:06
Wow, Macy is deep little creature.
Martin O'Toole 32:10
Big time. So I I respect everybody's truth, as you know.
Chris Siracuse 32:16
Uh huh.
Martin O'Toole 32:17
My truth is the Angela channelled my Beagle.
Chris Siracuse 32:23
Well, after I read that, and I like how you made me read it because you knew you knew that if I read it, then it would any bit of cynicism or scepticism I had inside of me would be quickly—
Martin O'Toole 32:37
melted
Chris Siracuse 32:38
well it job well done.
Martin O'Toole 32:40
Thanks, bro.
Chris Siracuse 32:41
Yeah, that's beautiful. I'm I'm sorry about Macy. You never told me that part of the story, which I guess you were you were waiting to have this nice kind of
Martin O'Toole 32:50
Yeah,
Chris Siracuse 32:51
Theatrical kind of thing.
Martin O'Toole 32:53
Well, I never I never knew I would tell it on a podcast if I'm brutally honest. But, but
Chris Siracuse 32:58
it's a nice way to do it.
Martin O'Toole 32:59
It seemed quite appropriate to share the story because my mum had died, which we'll talk about at some point on this podcast because that was kind of the beginning of the end of the beginning for me, and she died in 2014 Macy was around for that. And that was a fucking tram-smash. That was a mess.
Chris Siracuse 33:21
For our American audience trans mash is like a train crash
Martin O'Toole 33:24
train crash, tram-smash Yeah, mess it was a messy
Chris Siracuse 33:28
It was a mess
Martin O'Toole 33:28
messy time in my life and and of course the life of anybody around me but that dog stuck by my side and literally would come in and you know, cuddle me when I was sobbing and all this sort of stuff but but when Macy died, it I kind of it was a different type of loss. It was a and I fully appreciate it. Some people listen to this will be like, I can't believe you're talking in depth with such profundity about a dog dying, get over yourself, but anyone who has got a pet, or has had a pet who had a really close relationship with that pet will know what I'm talking about here. You should be able to grieve the death of a pet just like anybody else. Because actually, sometimes the pet is one of the closest characters in your life.
Chris Siracuse 34:09
Yeah,
Martin O'Toole 34:11
because dogs especially the the soul bearers of unconditional love well next to a baby, of course. So we have this very, very amazing relationship. And so after she died, and I found this out, I kind of it was a real test. It was the first test through through my my healing process. I was sober I was, I was clean. I was meditating, I'm doing yoga, I'm doing I'm doing the work, doing all you know, doing the whole thing. And this was the first big test. It was actually a friend of mine in England called Dan. Excuse me. He messaged me and said perhaps Macy's departure is an opportunity for you to consider the concept of impermanence. And I obviously knew the definition of that word, but he's a Buddhist and and that led me into a whole new arena of learning. And considering the, the practical utilities and if the handbook if you like, of Buddhism, I should say I'm not a Buddhist. I don't follow any one particular religion. I'm an Omnist which is probably more likely someone who believes that not what no one religion is the truth, but each religion carries truth. Notwithstanding that, I tend to think I'm in Alan Watts' car car, boat, I mean his car.
Chris Siracuse 35:49
Yeah. In his car, in his boat
Martin O'Toole 35:51
boat
Chris Siracuse 35:51
and whatever vehicle he's using
Martin O'Toole 35:53
He's in the astral as well
Chris Siracuse 35:54
whatever cosmic vehicle is
Martin O'Toole 35:56
probably messing around with Macy right now philosophising, but I'm with Alan Watts here. Alan Watts, believed that or argued that Buddhism is, is a form of psychotherapy,It's a manual for handbook. So mindfulness handbook mental health handbook. So anyway, not to go off topic because we're talking about dogs, and we're talking about death. But essentially, that brings us nicely up to what we're going to talk about in our next episode with Rebecca, which is loss. coping with accepting with processing loss. So you know, sorry, if I brought the vibe down.
Chris Siracuse 36:41
No, no, it's good. That's good. Hey, you bring the vibe up. You bring the vibe down, up and down. I mean, I, yeah. Wow, I got to collect myself here. Because I think part of my resistance is, is just feeling like, oh, there's definitely something to this, especially considering Macy was there. And you could say, and I think I would be the type of person that would say that she definitely knew what was going on with you that night in London.
Martin O'Toole 37:10
Absolutely. in Yorkshire, but yeah,
Chris Siracuse 37:12
sorry. I don't know m UK geography. And I absolutely think that, that we, humans, we animals serve purposes, and each other's lives, and we're inextricably linked in that way. And that she was there for lack of a better word for a purpose.
Martin O'Toole 37:31
Yep.
Chris Siracuse 37:32
And had some
Martin O'Toole 37:33
Pawpose.
Chris Siracuse 37:37
Sure. So yeah, that's Wow, what a beautiful story,
Martin O'Toole 37:42
isn't it? I and
Chris Siracuse 37:43
I'm glad you didn't kill yourself.
Martin O'Toole 37:45
Me too.
Chris Siracuse 37:46
Yeah, it's good to be able to have this conversation with you about suicide and about Macy, and preparing for this conversation with Rebecca,
Martin O'Toole 37:55
which is going to be a tough chat for for Well, not I don't think it'd be a tough job for us to have. But it's, it might be a tough thing for people to listen to.
Chris Siracuse 38:04
It might be Yeah,
Martin O'Toole 38:05
I kind of want that. That's the whole point of How To Die Happy. We need to be able to have really calm adult, forthright conversations about death and about the taboo around death. There's obviously there's a difference between taking your own life and just ending.
Chris Siracuse 38:26
Yeah,
Martin O'Toole 38:27
we must make the distinction. And it is my absolute desire that we reduce these, the suicides, the suicide numbers are exponentially growing. And it's it's really awful to see what's happening. We're going to talk more about that in the next session. But But we must be able to do it with with equal brevity.
Chris Siracuse 38:53
Yeah.
Martin O'Toole 38:53
Because death is a part of life.
Chris Siracuse 38:57
It is, it is, I feel like when it comes to the matter of suicide, I think it's there's a certain amount of control there. People like yes, death is a part of life and they want more control over it. Not to excuse it or condone it.
Martin O'Toole 39:12
Well, they want to go out. Sometimes I would imagine people think they're going out on their terms.
Chris Siracuse 39:18
Yeah, yeah.
Martin O'Toole 39:20
Although, as we also know, and as I also know, anyway, not to speak for anybody else firsthand. When you are that low, you are not thinking straight, you think you're thinking straight. That's because you are your own counsellor. And in reality, when you are that depressed, the last person you ought to be listening to, is you. So it's you rationalise we rationalise, we suicidal types, I say, I'm not the suicidal type anymore. I'm million miles off doing that I now I having come so close to dying, and then Having a near death experience a couple of years ago, I have a completely different perspective on on what it is to die, and what and on what it is to live, which is one of the reasons why we're doing this podcast.
Chris Siracuse 40:13
Absolutely. And what thank you for sharing that story, Martin.
Martin O'Toole 40:17
No worries.
Chris Siracuse 40:17
And thank you for setting up in such a nice way. And thank you for bringing a certain amount of levity I guess you would say
Martin O'Toole 40:26
yeah, it was a tale of well, wasn't it?
Chris Siracuse 40:28
It was a tale of well, but you managed to not make it. So so well we next time I want to tell you the story about how laziness saved my life.
Martin O'Toole 40:37
Amazing. I look forward to that.
Chris Siracuse 40:42
Yeah, man. Thank you, you want to leave the folks with anything?
Martin O'Toole 40:46
And if you are in any way, shape, or form considering suicide or harming yourself, please first and foremost don't. Second, reach out to someone total stranger. If it has to be probably will be because you obviously can't talk to the people around you. But don't do it. Just remember you are loved. And even if you don't know that you're loved or you don't feel loved by any of those people around you, you are loved by many you just don't know them.
Chris Siracuse 41:19
Absolutely. And whatever it is that you're feeling it most certainly will pass you know in the spirit of impermanence.
Martin O'Toole 41:25
Absolutely.
Chris Siracuse 41:26
Even those really awful things that feel like they will last forever they are also impermanent
Martin O'Toole 41:32
Got it in one.
Chris Siracuse 41:34
What's that?
Martin O'Toole 41:34
got it in one
Chris Siracuse 41:35
got it in one
Martin O'Toole 41:36
got it in one your English is coming up
Chris Siracuse 41:39
got it in one I just didn't want I think it's getting better. I think my accent's getting
Martin O'Toole 41:43
Marginally. You've stopped sounding like a Dickensian, genuine Cockney.
Chris Siracuse 41:48
Yeah,
Martin O'Toole 41:48
what was that guy called Dick Van Dyke. That's that's who you remind me of. Dick Van Dyke was a film he was a man he was always worried playing a genuine Cockney. He was a chimney sweep.
Chris Siracuse 41:58
I don't know
Martin O'Toole 41:59
the one about the witch and with the umbrella.
Chris Siracuse 42:01
Oh, bewitched,
Martin O'Toole 42:02
no
Chris Siracuse 42:03
Oh.
Martin O'Toole 42:05
spoonful of sugar helps the—remember your name Poppins. Mary Poppins.
Chris Siracuse 42:11
Poppins. Mary Poppins, we got it.
Martin O'Toole 42:14
Okay, let's pop out.
Chris Siracuse 42:15
Yeah, let's pop out. Thank you everyone.
Martin O'Toole 42:17
Ciao for now
Chris Siracuse 42:18
Be happy, be safe.
Martin O'Toole 42:19
Always. Peace and love.
Chris Siracuse 42:21
Think about all the people that love ya. Think about your animals most importantly.
Martin O'Toole 42:29
RUFF! So the thing I didn't mention was that Angela went on to tell me where Macy's body was and which was kind of strange because obviously she was in South Africa and she didn't know anything about where I was. But she'd she'd mentioned x y Zed metres away from the house in a certain direction in the bush there was a little bamboo bridge so myself, my buddy Richie, his two sons and their dog Rascal we went on a little search search and rescue now this was weeks after a call so and we knew that Macy was dead but I was I thought if I could find a body and because she said that she was in a deep shade and she so we spent hours searching around the bush around this bamboo bridge. Hot day took us—well we were really going into it and we couldn't find so we walked off was pretty tearful actually. And to this day, I still I still think I still imagine Macy just curled up under a little tree with some dust on her little nose, little baguette nose. Just mind in the deep shade.
Chris Siracuse 43:50
And that's how we all want to remember Macy
Martin O'Toole 43:54
sleeping in a sleeping in the deep shade. Yeah.
Chris Siracuse 43:57
That's beautiful. I love that. I do I really do.
Martin O'Toole 44:01
Yeah, I think it's a nice image.
Chris Siracuse 44:03
It is a nice image.
Martin O'Toole 44:03
A little curled up dog. And then I wrote an article about this. It was on elephant journal. And then a wonderful illustrator lady called Hannah sent me an illustration of Macy curled up asleep the story touched so much in is beautiful and little of her yeah I broke my my heart was already broken.
Chris Siracuse 44:26
God I feel like we need to get that image on somewhere where people can see it we got banned from Instagram so we can put it on there.
Martin O'Toole 44:33
Can't put it on Instagram. I forgot I forgot we were banned from Instagram
Chris Siracuse 44:38
Yeah we should probably tell people that
Martin O'Toole 44:39
Banned from Instagram for sharing the love what?!
Chris Siracuse 44:42
so that gives us some street cred I think Yeah, but but regardless though I would really like to see that image.
Martin O'Toole 44:48
I'll show you the photo, I'll find it. Super cute. Anyway... The End
